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"Not Meant for Public Distribution"

Daughter/Granddaughter/Wife of Veterans

American Citizen
VA
Mon Oct 29, 2007 10:36 AM

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My mom, a WWII veteran and Jewish Christian, was buried in May under the flag of the USA and by her pastor. My mom served her country and her God, both with honor and bravery. I expect this graveside tradition to continue for anyone who desires to have it. My dad served too but didn't want the ceremony so we didn't have it for him. My husband wants it, a Native American, so I plan to carry out his wishes when the time comes. In this life, you choose to serve and I think you should choose to be buried how you want to.

One test for flag ceremony

Purchasing Agent
USDA Forest Service
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:05 AM

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Shame on the VA! There should only be one means test for having the flag folding ceremony at a veterans funeral, and that would be; "Was the person an honorably discharged veteran or currently serving in the military?" If the answer was yes, the person should be laid to rest with the full honors they and their families deserve whatever religion they might or might not have practiced.
We can only hope that heads roll for whoever thought this one up.

Getting Rid of God

budget analyst
fsa
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:16 AM

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Shame on them for capitulating to the atheists. God was and should remain an integral part of the America. George Washington thought America was a Divine inspiration. God was inlcuded in every aspect of this government until the atheists proclaimed God is dead and the wacked out liberal judges went along with them. America needs MORE of God; not less.

Flag Folding Ceremony

Program Analyst
GSA
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:16 AM

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I am not a religious person, and I do not believe that our Government should support any religion as the official religoin of the Government. However, I see no issue with allowing religious references in a person's funeral. What seems wise to me is to ask the family how they want the flag ceremony done. After all it is the least we as a people should allow those who have given thier lives for their country. Giving a choice is not imposing a particular religious reference on anyone. If the person was an athiest, a choice to have no religious reference is appropriate, for instance. It should be a matter of free will to have or not have a religious reference, and that is the point.

Re: Flag Folding Ceremony

Contract Specialist
Treasury
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:25 AM
I am a devout and vociferous follower of Jesus Christ, but I fully understand the concept of free will. If someone choses a path during life, and wants it honored at a funeral ceremony as a witness to all those attending, that Veteran should be allowed that freedom of expression. Whether it be acceptance of Christianity, total rejection of God's grace, or some other ideology, the choice should be available. If not, exactly what did the Veteran's service and sacrifice amount to?

BANNING FLAG FOLDING CEREMONY AT FUNERALS

Education Instructor
USAF
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:22 AM

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This is just plain wrong. Out country was built in GOD's trust and we should all have the opportunity to decide whether we want the religious ceremony at our funeral or not. No agency should be able to denied the right of all people in this country. Denying us that priviledge because someone else complains is just plain wrong.

Learning to Read

Analyst
SSA
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:30 AM

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Didn't anyone read the flag code? There is no official script for folding the flag. The script in question is frequently used, but certainly not required. I've been at military funerals where no script was read, and the flag ceremony was still beautiful, respectful, and very moving.

Re: Learning to Read

Retired CWO
U.S. Coast Guard
Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:36 PM
I would have to agree with you on this one wholeheartedly. The article doesn't say that the VA is not going to continue to present the flag. It says that the Government will not participate in the promotion of an erroneous script that applies meaning to 13 different folds of the flag. This is outlined as urban legend on Snopes.com. The ceremony alludes to motherhood and fatherhood and all kinds of bunk.

In my time in the Coast Guard folding and presenting the flag to honor Coast Guardsman, we never used it, the DoD doesn't use it and I would be absolutely incensed if my Government forced me to listen to it when my father passes (an Army veteran). Let's get the facts before we berate our Government for not forcing our literary choices on an unsuspecting public.

Re: Learning to Read

HR specialist
retired
Mon Oct 29, 2007 1:25 PM
I was surprised to learn that there is a script. I've been to several military funerals, and observed the flag folding and presentation ceremony. No words were ever uttered, it was always a silent and very solemn event. I do agree with the comments that the event should meet the soldier's and his/her family's wishes. I disagree with those who insist god has to be mentioned because it was Christians who founded this country. That's a slap in the face to those Americans, and their non-christain ancestors, who fought and died for this country.

Re: Learning to Read

Air Force Manager
Air Force
Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:11 PM
I've observed the "spoken" flag folding ceremony several times at Air Force retirements. The words varied based on the religious intent of the person being honored. I believe the Air Force did direct the elimination of the religious version of the ceremony.

I'm concerned that the real issue is being lost here. I simply cannot imagine this spoken ceremony being appropriate at a funeral. As one other person noted, the flag is folded into its triangular shape as a practical (and striking) presentation; the words were added by someone to apply meaning where none existed or was intended. The words simply are not necessary when honoring the dead.

Give these veterans their due respect. Remove the flag from the coffin; fold it solemnly and silently; present it with our gratitude. That--by itself--is meaning enough.

Veterans’ constitutional rights violated again

General supply speicalist
NAVSUP
Mon Oct 29, 2007 11:56 AM

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The military takes an oath to defend the Constitution against enemies foreign and domestic. Is it not odd then that the VA would violate the veteran and their family’s constitutional rights? It is things like this that makes me feel I wasted 37 years of my life defending the Constitution.

Total Comments: 64
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