Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

The TSP currently supports both passive and aggressive activity. The designers of TSP create and enforce policies of the TSP system, the investor was presented with a convenient web based portal to access accounts and manage investments. The current TSP policies are at issue here and I challenge those at TSP to find a fair way to continue supporting both types of investors and not ignore or attempt to punish either. We have all been following the TSP rules to invest in, and doing so within the TSP systems support structure which I might add has been running this way for YEARS.

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

I find it hard to belive that 99% of government employees do not take an active role in managing their TSP accounts! They must all be either unaware, uninformed or uneducated when it comes to the basic principles of investing! Or they have all been brainwashed?
The old adage "buy low, sell high" is still the key to making the maximum profit on your investments!
Any worthwhile investment advisor will tell you that the "buy and hold" for the long run strategy is the certain way to guarantee minimum return on your investment.
It is not hard to identify trends in the market up or down, (market timing). By buying the dips and selling the peaks many of us who actively manage our TSP accounts have been able to increase our returns anywhere from 10% to as much as 50% above the normal returns provided by any of the TSP funds if you just put your money there and left it!
I urge all of you to take a more active role in managing your accounts, educate yourselve, you are losing a lot of money

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

The real reason the TSP Board must stop these 3,000 people from trading is simple. Those 3,000 are making too much money (profit). It has nothing to do with trading costs, if it did then they would just charge members for each trade like mutual funds do! Just read the article, they made how many millions trading those five days in October?. If the other 3.9 million members ever figure out how much money these 3,000 are making then everyone will start trading and this would overwhelm the TSP system. Also, we can't have everyone in the government becoming a millionaire now, can we, what would the public think? Had these 3,000 been losing money then there would not even have been an issue!
We grow too soon old and too late smart! Invest wisely.

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

Let’s face reality.

1.)Every time you juggle between accounts, the cost of the trade is borne by all TSP holders. It's not all about you.

2.)Investment advisors make money by churning stocks; they will always advise you to trade.

3.)When the market is tanking, you can only stop the bleeding; When the market is increasing is when you make money in TSP

4.)The market indexes are more volatile to market speculation and not on the fundamentals of the companies; call your psychic for a better market prospectus.

If you want to day trade, get an E-trade account.

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

Limiting trades is an awful idea. When TSP'ers were limited to 1 trade a month before the web-based system, it was impossible to employ solid asset allocation methods. It will also be more difficult to preserve capital and slowly buy your way back into the markets at the end of bear cycles -- especially when moving hundreds of thousands of dollars. This will ultimately lower returns for those that invest actively and have taken the time and effort to learn various investment strategies, market analysis and econimic conditions. Why punish those that have worked so hard to get to this point... only to save what amounts to less than $10 a year per average TSP participant. In the long run you're shooting youself in the foot and probably bearing a greater load on Social Security.

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

I can't belive you put down:

"Get an e-trade account."

I am one of the 3000, I know it, why? because I trade my funds. You say you are a financial analyst. If so, how come you are not trying to halt this? I have a so called e-trade account. and guess what? I trade there too. If I worry about my retirment, NO MATTER how I am invested, I try to make the most of it. Your flippant "set it and forget it" attitude makes me question your qualifications to be an analyst in a financial arena. Please, we want to make money, we want to retire, we inject money into the economy. We want what's fair.

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

Hello? Did anyone notice that a WHOPPING 92% of the $15M cost for 2006 was from the "I" Fund? This equates to $13.8M versus $1.2M for all other funds combined! If I recall, this fund didn't even exist until 2004/2005! Simple solution to a simple problem. A) Charge for trading in the "I" fund or B) eliminate the "I" fund. To change the rules after we have invested in our future is wrong! We have no way of pulling out all of our money because we don't like the proposed change in the rules...and we're talking BILLIONS contributed by individuals. And to the IRS Auditor, please explain to us all WHY we can't have millionaires retiring from the government? I don't know what the IRS contributes, but us dipolomatic types here in State only get matched by 5%...I'm curently contributing 15% of my own income and agressively managing my TSP account, and am earning on average an 8% annual return....I will be retiring as a millionaire, with my own money and hard work. What's wrong with that?

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

I have to laugh at so many people responding to this. It certainly appears there is a lot of ignorance and some jealousy of those who may be secure enough to actively use TSP to earn funds for her/his retirement. It's pathetic some call these people, "abusers." First, don't you have any clues about Uncle Sam wanting to have that money available in the G Fund when Uncle Sam needs to borrow YOUR money? Yes, it has been done (or didn't you know?)! Second, don't you realize that the L funds are rebalanced each night so that the fund percentages in their accounts match the target L fund percentage for that month? This is, effectively, an interfund transfer for EACH ACCOUNT, DAILY. Hello? Before ignorantly attacking, why not do some research and learn that TSP ALREADY DOES DAILY MOVES OF THE L FUNDS! Humm...TSP has some concern about maybe 3,000 people when there are over 500,000 daily balance changes in the F fund. Ever wonder how much those 5000,000 balancing events cost?

Re: Sounds Like a Good Idea

To GSA Financial Analyst

You have a misconcemption about the L funds

There are only five interfund transfers each day for the L funds - one for each fund.

Each investor owns shares of the L funds so each investor doesn't have an interfund transfer.

Re: Day Traders

You hit the nail on the head. What you proposed is such a fair, simple, logical, and workable solution that gives everyone what they want any other solution looks absurd compared to it. One can only wonder what sort of “financial leaders” are running the TSP when this solution is not obvious to them.

Re: Day Traders

There is no great demand for a new service. I can't imagine the administrative costs associated with implementing a new service for approximately 3,000 versus over a million participants. I am unwilling to share the costs for so few. TSP is a retirement fund and was never meant as a way to play the stock market.. Apparently, these day traders have a misconception of anything associated with the stock market. What they are doing is totally ludicrious and I am not willing to pay for their stupidity.

Re: Day Traders

I agree, we should charge the 3000 or so "day traders" for what they cost the rest of us. So let's see, $15 million divided by 3000 comes to an annual cost of $5,000 or so, per day trader.

On the other hand, there are other accounts set up precisely for this which these folks can join, pay their fee and day-trade all they want.

Limit the changes which can be made to the TSP to one or two per month for the rest of us. It has been shown, pretty conclusively, that if you leave your money in for the long haul you will do better than if you try to play the market anyway.

Re: Day Traders

Here, Here! Give the man a slap on the back! The TSP system should be looked as a "evolving" retirement system, it's still in it's infancy, participants are just now looking and getting involved since they changed trade limits to daily. As changing the trade deadline was one way the retirement system has evolved, now there is a need for a new service to pay for active trading. Lets not go backwards but move forward with a new and improved retirement system.

Re: Day Traders

Nothing comes for free. Services cost money and resources to set up and manage, and I can guarantee all of us would end up bearing the cost. Not to mention, there's a very small demand for this service.

TSP was meant to be a long term, retirement investment. There are lots of private services out there that will be glad to provide this service for you, so go see a stockbroker.

Re: Day Traders

My bottom line is that I'm in favor of the current system being changed (since 1 in 1000 are abusing it and it's costing the rest of us), to either a fee for over a certain number of trades per month or year, OR a reasonable limit (and I think 2 "free" trades per month is too many especially when the TSP Board is proposing to allow transfers to the G Fund as not being part of those 2/month) and then pay for each trade beyond the limit.

When this was brought up previously by FedSmith the majority was opposed to any kind of fee system, so it may be why the TSP Board is thinking of going to the limit instead. Plus a limit could be much more easily enforced I would imagine.

My preference was originally for a "fee system" since I am nearing retirement and I reallocate by TSP balance infrequently. Frankly I think the stock market is in denial BIG TIME, and I don't want my TSP funds anywhere near a stock when it looks like we're going into a recession and I'm nearing retirement!!!

Re: Day Traders

Mr. Procurement Analyst from Dept of State, I am a day trader and made almost an extra 10% compared to the other funds. So lets be careful using the stupid word. The months they are complaining about were some of the worst months in the C, S, and I funds so of course there is going to be heavy trading. They should charge an extra fee if this is a problem. I totally disagree with forcing active particapants to do it by mail though until it gets switched over.

Re: Day Traders

If day traders are costing me profit in my RETIREMENT account, then they should have to pay for their trades over the 2 allotted per month. It is like someone taking money out of your back pants pocket just because you didn't move it to your front shirt pocket the previous day. Have respect for others; if you want to day trade, get a stockbrocker or and e-trade account. Play fast, furious and loose with YOUR money, not mine or all the other TSP investors who are losing profits due to your trading plays.