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Ex-convicts, Veteran's Preference, and Rehiring A Former Federal Employee

Ex-Convicts

supervisor
GSA
Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:31 AM

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it would take someone with a convict mentality to think he could prevail in such a case.

Re: Ex-Convicts

Biologist
HHS
Fri Jul 18, 2008 9:06 AM
Especially since even vets with clean records have long odds of getting in the door when management doesn't want them.

Ex-convicts

Prog Mgt
ISRA
Fri Jul 18, 2008 8:54 AM

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.....or someone who felt he was owed something because of grievances from the past. It any case, it's a case of gimme, gimme, gimme!

ex-convict

Retired
SSA
Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:01 AM

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If his crime was not connected with his employment, he should be considered for the job. If he was a good employee in the past, he would most likely improve his performance if given a second chance. If he is entitled to veteran's preference, he should get it. If his appeal was flawed that's a shame.

Re: ex-convict

Retired
Dept of Energy
Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:32 AM
This is for the retired SSA employee:

With all due respect, giving this guy preferential treatment just because you want to forgive him, allows him to be hired ahead of others who have never been felons. Personally, I don't feel that's fair. And it sends a confusing message to young people who are being taught to obey the law.

Re: ex-convict

Retired
SSA
Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:04 PM
I said considered for the job, not given the job instead of someone who was more qualified. I don't think he should be given special treatment, just fair treatment.

BLACK VETERANS HIRED AS A SO-CALLED QUOTA

APPLICATION SUPPORT CENTER MANAGER
USCIS
Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:44 AM

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I agree that the case with Mr. Fortenberry vs. MSPB, that the final decision was correct. However, look at what we African American veterans are confronted with.

This is not a complaint but a fact; I must say that some of the old discriminating hiring practices within the USCIS are still in effect and they are in our opinion gross and should have a congressional inquiry done. There seem to be a total disconnect between African American veterans and management. The veterans that are being hired at the 14 District in Chicago are subjected to unfair hiring and or promotions.

These African American veterans are from all branches of the United States Armed Services. The treatment of one veteran should be the treatment of all veterans. For instance a white veteran of the Coast Guards was promoted and given high honors of his alleged tour in the Gulf, some years ago and this was found to be untrue of his tour by other veterans. However, the veteran is indeed a veteran and should be honored but not at the expense of other veterans, not being honored and or promoted.

Some of the most nonprofessional statements came from management, regarding this issue were made such as, he (white-male) veteran, served honorably, as if the Black veterans had not served their country honorably. The fact is that the veteran in question did not go to the Middle East and or the Gulf, in fact, it was reported to us that he stayed in the United States, during his 2 years absence. Furthermore, he had an excused absence from the USCIS for over two (2) Years. This was an essential matter because the Supervisory position was written up to get those qualified to well qualified personnel.

How is it possible to promote a veteran and or non veteran, to a level of management over those incumbents, who were as equally qualified and or well qualified? What qualifications did this white veteran (being 2 Years absent) from the USCIS, gain while away that long. We, African Americans served in the United States military and at no time were immigration offered and or mentioned as our primary and or secondary duties.

The USCIS, Chicago District’s management are somewhat bias, regarding gender. Most of the supervisors and management positions are females. We are not suggesting that anything is wrong with hiring or promoting females but look at the statistics and you will see a total unbalance, regarding the genders. The mere fact that those African American veterans are not giving the same opportunities in hiring and promotions as our white counter parts are to suggest that African Americans are not wanted at higher levels within USCIS and particularly at the Chicago’s District.

Is this a reflection of the overall opinion of its (USCIS) policy towards a protected group, being African Americans and not military? Remember, the Chicago’s District has 1 % of African Americans who are above the grade of GS13 and the District has a considerable size of employees.

Re: BLACK VETERANS HIRED AS A SO-CALLED QUOTA

Ex USCIS Officer
USCIS
Fri Jul 18, 2008 4:46 PM
I used to work for USCIS somewhere in the southern US and was employed as a term employee. USCIS mgmt. dismissed me and retained several other term employees. And I am white. I have over ten years experience, but they still let me go. So, I agree that the mgmt. is bad in USCIS. I feel your pain about CIS mgmt.

Re: BLACK VETERANS HIRED AS A SO-CALLED QUOTA

Analyst
DOD
Mon Jul 21, 2008 8:26 AM
What does black verses white have anything to do with ex-cons? Evertime something like this comes up it turns into and white verse black thing.

Hiring or Rehiring Ex Cons

HR Manager (Retired)
DoD
Fri Jul 18, 2008 11:51 AM

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The "one size fits all" approach does not fit when considering ex cons for employment or reemployment. As one who had the responsibility of making the hire-don't hire decision for our base, I can tell you that you must treat each case individually. Yes, they are all ex cons but each has his/her own set of circumatances and conditions. They type of job for which the person is being considered is also key to the final decision. Failure to use the "case by case" approach when making a decision, as well as failure to document your rationale, will not pass the 3rd party review process. Yes, I approved the hiring of some ex cons and did not live to regret it. My decisions not to hire some ex cons also withstood 3rd party review.

re: ex-con

electronics tech
noaa
Fri Jul 18, 2008 1:24 PM

Post Reply

Everyone makes a mistake now and then, he paid
his debt; give him his job back it's totally insane to make
him pay forever.

Re: re: ex-con

Worker
DoD
Fri Jul 18, 2008 2:38 PM
He has no "right" to his former job. If the agency wants to hire him, they will. But, if the jobs he applies for require a security clearance, he may never get hired.

Re: re: ex-con

Retired
Dept of Energy
Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:14 PM
Again, following the rationale of the last two commenters, those who deserve a FIRST chance, and who have not screwed up, are passed over. Now they're thinking, "Okay, I'll go out and commit a felony. That will give me a leg up in the federal government hiring process. After all, it was the felon who got the preferential treatment over me."

I'm not saying don't give someone who deserves it a second chance. However, fair is fair. If there is to be preferential treatment, give it FIRST to those who have followed the rules, and who deserve their first chance.

Re: re: ex-con

PERSEC
Army
Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:55 PM
Why should he automatically get his job back? He went to jail. Should he be barred from applying or being hired? No. Ex Cons can get security clearances (and do, now and then) and work in most jobs after a few years of good behavior outside the pen, but why should he get automatic rehire?

"Sorry guys, I'm off now and reporting for 2-5 years with possibility of parole tomorrow, I'll be back at work first thing when I'm out!"

Doesnt fly

Whether or Not To Hire Ex-cons

Secretary
Dept of Veterans Affairs
Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:18 PM

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Ex-cons should be hired on ability as should all people. They have paid their debt to society, whether they were truly innocent or guilty of the crime they were convicted of. Everyone deserves a second chance and the innocent and their families should not continue being victimized. Those with money go free and those without rarely get true justice. At the rate the justice system is making criminals out of innocent people, there will be more people in prison than outside of prison. Existing laws tie the hands of the judges, jury, and the lawyers from pursuing true justice.

Total Comments: 15
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