Re: No Way!

Blah, blah, blah.....age bashing.....blah, blah.

And now for some reality: the baby boom is generally accepted to have ended in 1964, putting any number of us only in our 40's. So get used to the idea that you're going to have some of the "Old Guard" around for years to come. Further, we're not nearly as uneducated as the younger folks would like to think; I'm working on my 3RD college degree. My husband is also a baby boomer fed., who has not been to college, but had enough work experience PRIOR to taking his fed. job that those who hired him considered his knowledge the equivalent of a doctoral degree. Advanced college degrees can be helpful, but they're not the be-all-end-all.

Yes, I've seen some very hard-working dedicated younger employees come into gov't. I've seen an equal or greater number who only come in looking for new & different ways to get more leave time. Give me a 30-year worker over a newbie anyday. At least I'll know who will stick with the job.

Re: No Way!

As an HR professional, I am REALLY sick and tired of people "HR Bashing". Since you all seem to have all the answers, perhaps you should try to be an HR Specialist and see how fast you can get something issued when you have to open a vacancy for 30 days (REQUIRED by the agency's Merit Promotion Plan), then have to wait for 10 days to get all of the "postmarked by the closing date" applications; issue a certificate with veterans blocking the name request that the Manager wants and have the Manager go ballistic and try to ILLEGALLY get around the veterans; have Managers SIT on certificates for up to 90 days (3 MONTHS!) after you have issued it before they finally make a selection; and last but not least, have the Manager return everything unused because he/she doesn't "like any of the applicants, let's advertise again!". I have empathy for supervisors and employees for all you put up with, perhaps you could return the favor to your HR co-workers? THANK YOU!

Re: No Way!

Excuse me Mr. HR Specialist, but you are not a professional if you are in the 200 series according to federal classification/qualification standards. You are in an administrative position that does NOT require a 4yr college degree. 2ndly, you need not wait 30 days to fill a federal position. Your merit promotion plan is just ONE of MANY ways to fill a federal job. 3rd, less than 3% of all hires at Interior were through the merit promotion process & I suspect this is true govtwide. What a waste of time & resources. Automated systems will/have not changed this. 5th, most agencies including DOD use only a handful of the many ways to fill federal jobs. Why? Because hiring officials don't know about the various hiring options and flexibilities for hiring federal employees. Many of these other hiring authorities have been on the books for over 30 yrs. Employees, applicants & supervisors will continue to be held hostage to this state of affairs until OPM takes the proper initiatives.

Re: Hiring Personnel

Here we go again. No matter how "streamlined" you try to make the process, the government is not the private sector for hiring purposes. It's not a matter of "micromanaging" - it's a matter of laws that we have to uphold - and once laws are on the books, how many ever go off? All of them are there to satisfy a legitimate requirement, but take them on an accumulated basis & pretty soon the process becomes cumbersome. One thing that would help is making more use of temporary hiring authorities, particularly in filling "project" type work, i.e. "cash for clunkers" & similar programs.

Re: Hiring process

Your points are very valid. Feds should be able to move around easily. However, shuffling the deck chairs on the Titanic is not really the answer. We need candidates from outside the Government to fill the ranks. Many hiring officials look within their organization to fill a position because of the knowledge they bring with them. Looking outside the Government means the perception of "they don't know how we do things here". They may not, and we should listen to that. They may have a better way of doing something. Our Interns are brilliant, hard working, and want to make a positive impact. Of course, as an Agency, we get that out of their heads as fast as we can. BTW, private corporations do the same thing.

Re: Hiring process

I couldn't agree with DoD Supervisor. I came in at a GS-13 from the outside. Within a month after I came on board, the manager that hired me accepted another position and I got a new manager. The new manager was of the opinion that "I didn't know anything" since I had not been a civil servant for 15+ years like my team members. He was very skeptical whatever I said. It took about six months for me to prove to him that my ideas and recommendations were valid and actually presented viable and practical solutions to issues. He did a "180" of sorts and acually tried to promote me to the GS-14 level before my 52 weeks was up...of course I had to wait. Then my director wanted to promote me to a GS-15 before I had done my 52 weeks at GS-14. Again I had to wait. But I still made it to GS-15 after only two years of Federal service. So, I agree that people from the outside can come into Federal service and add value. My old manager now says he wants to hire from the "outside" now.

Re: Revamping the hiring process

YOUR understanding that the federal employment process is the way it is due to EEO complaints is in error. The open and full consideration of citizens for federal employment regardless of RNOG & disability that the OPM and HR Offices are required to adhere to is under a separate statute than EEOC's Title VII. Don't feel bad though, EEOC Offices don't know this either. All competitive federal employment processes are based on best practices to assess one's qualifications for performing the work successfully. But how & where you recruit, the basis for selection & selection trends is what raises questions of inequity. At Interior, the selection of African-Americans and Asians is the lowest of all groups despite having 2 to 3 times as many Best Qualifieds of all groups. "Passable" is not good enough. Don't put the responsibility on the taxpayer to understand what you at OPM can't figure out. I was a supervisor at one of the JICs with the OPM. Plz update/upgrade your OPM web pages.